Rabbi Kanefsky might be naive and misguided, but he's anything but smug and self-righteous. Your ad hominem attacks detract from your very legitimate criticism of his position.

As for a "romper room" congregation - please keep in mind that you have many readers, acquaintances and friends who are members.

Respectfully,
Ralphie

Ralphie:

We appreciate your input and apologize for our ad hominem attacks on your congregation.

Let's be clear though, Kanefsky's political and social positions are smug and self-righteous.

" ... As we said, we'd like nothing better than to ignore Kanefsky, a sad-sack and quite stupid leftie crank in Pico Robertson area, ... , but naturally the story was picked up by the Los Angeles Times, a paper that would like nothing better than to see Israel disappear from the map. ... "

interesting that this should be posted 'today'.

today is a Very Special Yohrtzeit.

it is written, that on the day of a Yohrtzeit, all that a person strived for in his life, is uplifted

may these spiritual energies defeat the designs of those who would harm the Jewish people, on this day,
the Yohrtzeit of,
Harav Meir Dovid Kahane ZT"L
(Hamokom Yenakem Domoy)

FYI: Our weekly distribution is 50, 000 papers and we have an estimated 300,000 readers.

We've had over 200,000 page views so far this month.

You math is a wrong as your politics.

You might print 50,000 copies and leave them lying around, but no way do they get read. One has only to casually walk around the neighborhood to see piles and piles of the journal left unread after the weekend. In my shul, most end in the trash.

Let's see: you don't disagree with my politics, but they are just wrong.

Spoken like true heir to Stalinist thought.

Thanks so much for your comment, they are highly revealing.

Hashem Yikom Damo? Wasn't Meir Kahane a terrorist? Don't we generally not look favorably upon those who hated Arabs as much as many Arabs hate us, especially when that hatred is not merely responding in kind, but a special breed of chauvinism, jingoism, and a general misunderstanding of the concept of Am Yisrael as the am ha-nivchar?

Daniel:

Rabbi Kahane was not a terrorist. He never killed, much less physically harmed anyone in his entire life.

Robert,

The fact that Kahane never personally committed any acts of terrorism seems not to be relevant. What about an individual who never personally committed any acts of terrorism, but instead planned them? What if our hypothetical person didn't even plan them, but merely incited them with hate speech or other antagonistic rhetoric? Would said person still not be a terrorist? What if, hypothetically, Osama bin Laden, le-havdil elef alfei alafot, had never harmed a hair on a single person's head, but had merely planned the atrocious attacks of 11 September? Would he fail your "terrorist test?" In this very post you describe leftists as Jew-killers by dint of their collaborative language. Is it at all surprising that Kahane's presentation of his ideology have led to violence against Arabs?

Daniel:

This is not hypothetical. To say that Kahane never personally committed any acts of terror is irrelevant is morally outrageous. It leads to a world where there is no distinction between those who kill and those who do not.

Well welcome to the left and the world of moral equivalence.

The fact is Kahane was the head of a tiny party with a tiny following that never planned planned any terrorist acts, nor incited any terrorists acts.

The left has abetted Jew-killers aplenty. The retreats from Lebanon and Gaza have made those areas into fronts for Hizbullah and Hamas. Hundreds of Jews have been killed as a result.

The only violence against Arabs is by the IDF and it is in national self-defense.

BTW, Kahane was assassinated by an Arab terrorist. I know, I know, Kahane made him do it 'cause Kahane was such a meanie.

Have you ever spoken to rabbi kanefsky or personally heard him speak ? Yet you have the chutzpah to write that he would be likely to lead the judenrat ? You should do massive teshuvah for your words.

As someone who learns torah with him twice weekly I can tell you that his intellectual capabilities and torah knowledge dwarf anything reflected in the comments of anyone attacking him here.

It's hilarious that in your guidelines for comments you write "we are respectful" while you write in the most infantile disrespectful terms about a rav and his kahal. Ever hear of derech eretz ? kavod harav ? You and your fellow slammers should be ashamed of yourselves. Have you ever set foot in bnai david to conclude it is a "romper room "congregation ?

tell us where do you daven and learn ?

As for the substance of his remarks the fact that it is even controversial to note that 100,000s of palestinians have been displaced by settlements and that indefinitely ruling over them is untenable is a clear demonstration of what the Rabbi writes about: lack of honesty. The vast majority of israelis have recognized this years ago. You should note that the Israeli political definition of Jerusalem extends all the way to ramallah. The rabbi did not propose a negotiating tactic or a final settlement proposal (tell that to your friend omri who doesn't permit comments). He gave food for thought.

He was willing to tell people that thinking israel can indefinitely rule over all of the occupied territories and "hashem yishmor" for the consequences is a pure fantasy.

The rav's talmud class is open to anyone every monday at 7 30. Please come, it will be interesting to see your command of jewish sources compared to the rav.

Or perhaps you could post a cohesive paragraph by paragraph rebuttal instead of vicious childish invective.

" ... Have you ever spoken to rabbi kanefsky or personally heard him speak ? Yet you have the chutzpah to write that he would be likely to lead the judenrat ? You should do massive teshuvah for your words.

As someone who learns torah with him twice weekly I can tell you that his intellectual capabilities and torah knowledge dwarf anything reflected in the comments of anyone attacking him here. ... "

i'm sure that the Neturei Karta people who met with Ahmadinajad were also quite able to 'learn',
and davened in very frum shuls ...

this does not give them the right to endanger Jewish lives

maybe Rabii Kanefsky should do Teshuba"
and maybe consider advocating that the Temple mount and Jerusalem were Jewish for more than 1000 years before Mohmammad was born,
and maybe they should go to the conference table with the 'honest' suggestion that they, and a large portion of Iraeli and world Jewry, would like to see the mosques and all Arab presence removed from the Jewish holy sites

(something that would unquestionably already have been done by Arabs if the situation were reversed)

" ... Have you ever spoken to rabbi kanefsky or personally heard him speak ? Yet you have the chutzpah to write that he would be likely to lead the judenrat ? You should do massive teshuvah for your words.

As someone who learns torah with him twice weekly I can tell you that his intellectual capabilities and torah knowledge dwarf anything reflected in the comments of anyone attacking him here. ... "

i'm sure that the Neturei Karta people who met with Ahmadinajad were also quite able to 'learn',
and davened in very frum shuls ...

this does not give them the right to endanger Jewish lives

maybe Rabii Kanefsky should do Teshuva"
and maybe consider advocating that the Temple mount and Jerusalem were Jewish for more than 1000 years before Mohmammad was born,
and maybe they should go to the conference table with the 'honest' suggestion that they, and a large portion of Iraeli and world Jewry, would like to see the mosques and all Arab presence removed from the Jewish holy sites

(something that would unquestionably already have been done by Arabs if the situation were reversed)

it is hilarious and pathetic that all you critics can do is launch vicious nonsensical personal attacks instead of addressing the issue at hand.

as for your fantasy that the majority of jews would want mosques "removed from jewish holy sites" where does that fantasy come from and to what are you referring ? kever machpelah ?

If you were "honest" you would substitute "tiny minority" for "vast majority"

btw oome to the class before you question his approach to torah learning. Also come to the shabbat services where a prayer for tzahal, the captive soldiers and medinat yisrael is said each week and most of the high school grads spend a year in israel before you make some ridiculous neturei carta comparison.

Your comment about how the Arabs maintained our holy places reminded me-- my uncle's grave is on Har Hazeitim. When we took back Jerusalem and Har Hazeitim, we found that his gravestone was among those that had been recycled as the wall of a latrine. So it goes.

Mr. Weinman:

Yosef Kanefsky leads a congregation, hence his words and actions directly reflect on B'nei David Judea and its members. He has brought shame on all of you.

I am a Hollywood screenwriter, I do not write in the name of my shul, thus where I daven and with whom I learn are not relevant.

Yes, I have been in your shul many times. Yes, I have met Yosef Kanefsky. Yes, I have heard Kanefsky speak. The most memorable speech was several years ago at a community rally for Israel, when homicide bombing was at an all time high and Jewish blood was flowing like water. Rav after rav stood up and spoke on behalf of Israel and Jews. Kanefsky ended his speech with a ringing: "...and justice for the Palestinian people!"

Everyone was like, "Did he really say that?" They are slaughtering innocent Jews at Pesach seders and he's singing Kumbaya?

It was, to say the least, insensitive and inappropriate.

Your Rabbi, in his article, was not giving, as you put it, food for thought. That's your default position, a rhetorical device to deflect from the hodge-podge of tired, whiny leftist scolds which ultimately lead to Kanefsky's logic of, ahem, truth, and dividing Jerusalem——his final truth.

Fact: Israel has been at war with her Arab neighbors before there was ever a so-called occupation. Hence, occupation cannot be a cause for the conflict. The cause is the Jewish State.

Fact: Islam cannot tolerate an ascendant Jewish power in Muslim lands. It goes against the Koran, and is an affront to all Muslim sensibilities.

Fact: This is a religious ideological war that pits jihad against western/Jewish values. "Occupation" and "refugees" and "poverty" are merely fig-leafs to massage western liberals.

Fact: Both Hamas and Fatah say in their official charters that the occupation encompasses the "entire Zionist entity." In plain English that calls for the destruction of the State of Israel.

Fact: Part of the Hamas charter is based on The Protocol of the Elders of Zion. The charter also calls for the elimination of the Jewish people or their status as dhimmis.

Fact: Gaza is not "occupied" and it is now a forward base for Hizbullah, Islamic Jihad, Al Quada, Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade, etc. These groups have openly stated that Israel's withdrawal is a victory for armed struggled and is proof of the weakness of the Zionist enemy.

Fact: When Israel was divided Jordanian snipers used to sit on the walls of the Old City and casually pick off Jews in Jerusalem.

Fact: 22 Arab States are Judenrein. Gaza makes 23. There are 1 million Arab citizens in Israel. Why is it acceptable to Jews like you that all Arab territory be Judenrein.

Fact: Judea and Samaria, except for one single precinct, all voted for Hamas in the last elections. The only force that keeps Hamas from power is the IDF. You and your Rav may be anxious to see Hamas in power in Judea and Samaria but I prefer to see Hamas annihilated.

Fact: You daven for the Israeli MIA's in your shul. Your children go to Israel for a year. Mazal Tov. You are, after all, an Orthodox shul. That's what you're supposed to do.

Fact: This is about understanding genocidal jihad, about rational political judgment.

When will the leaders of our community and the OU come out and say we will no longer associate ourselves with B'nei David as long as Rabbi Yosef is their leader. They should not hold their community wide Tisha Baav Mincha at B'nei David. They should not have any part of the OU convention at B'nei David. We should not even rent out their simcha hall for private parties or step foot in their building

We should protest in front of the shul demanding that the board remove Kanefsky from his post.
We should encourage any friends that we have at B'nei David to cancel their membership and demand that the rabbi be replaced.

I am very happy that the members of B'nei David send their kids to Israel for a year to study after high school, let’s just hope that they all choose schools outside the holy city of Yerushalayim lest they find them selves on the wrong side of Kanefskys line.

I have once question will you retract your vicious ad hominem attacks thus abiding by your own guidelines for comments:

"We debate, we discuss, we are respectful."

In your view is it "respectful" to call someone you disagree with akin to someonw that chose jews to be marched to the ovens ?

I can tell you write fiction because you engage in it here when did i or the rav ever say to lead you to conclude either of us is

"anxious to see Hamas in power in Judea "

in fact he wrote this about facts :

"the Palestinians aren't telling an honest story either. They are not being honest about their record of violence against Jews in the pre-State era, or about the obscene immorality with which they attacked Israeli civilians during the second intifada. They are not being honest about the ways in which their fellow Arabs are responsible for so much of the misery that they -- the Palestinians -- have endured, and they certainly are not being honest about the deep and real historical connection that the Jewish people has to this land and to this holy city. And there will not be peace (and perhaps there should be no peace conference) until they tell an honest story as well"

but of course it would have taken a reality based person to actually read something by someone they call a nazi collaborator

do you support meir kahane's "solution" of forcible expulsion of the arab population ?

since you so readily opine on matters concerning the jewish future why is it irrelevant with whom you learn. And what does "i am a screenwriter" have to do with anything. I learn torah with lawyers, social workers,teachers and scientists. It is incumbent upon all jews to learn torah . Please, who do you consider your rebbes ?

I googled a list of your screenwriting ouevre, quite impressive.

oops was that disrespectful ?

I will end my posts here. Try to keep your fiction to your screenwriting where you make up dialogue, rather than putting words into the mouths of others here. It would be more honest and "respectful".

Mr. Weinman:

I will absolutely retract and apologize for my ad hominem attacks for they detract from my main attack, which is that Yosef Kanefsky's politics and article gives aid and succor to Israel's enemies.

I never brought up Rabbi Kahane. He was brought up by another commenter who called him a terrorist intent on equating Kahane's political views with physical violence, a tactic of the arch left.

I do not support forcible expulsion of the Arab population.

Nor did I support the forcible expulsion of Jews from Gaza. I warned that that would not lead to peace, but further violence and Gaza would become Gazastan.

That was an easy call.

Nor do I support the forcible expulsion of Jews from Judea and Samaria for the results will be even more disastrous than Gaza. Not just for Israel but for Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan who are terrified of seeing Hamas ascendant in those areas. Jordan will, undoubtedly, at some point, be forced into a replay of Black September. The last thing they want is to see the IDF out of Judea and Samaria.

One must take responsibility for one's political opinions. When Kanefsky and his ilk on the extreme left agitate for endless concessions this leads to the rise of Hamas and other terrorist organizations.

That is a truth the left refuses to face. That's why I accuse (a rhetorical device) Kanefsky of being anxious to see Hamas in power.

It helps to recognize that there are consequences to one's actions.

I've known Yosef Kanefsky for more than 40 years and he has always been known for his honesty, humbleness and intelligence. While we may not agree on all the issues, at least he offers a perspective that is different than-"I have no solution"so let's keep the status quo. Clearly the statis quo is an indefensible position but those who advocate lack the courage to make war and actually settle the land or the vision to make peace. It is easy to snipe from LA especially when you offer no solution.

Finally Bnei David is more than a romper room. It is a place where all are welcome, are not prejudged by the way they look or their background.

AN OPEN LETTER TO RABBI KANEFSKY, A MUST READ. EDUCATIONAL.

Dear Rabbi Kanefsky,

Your efforts at upholding the truth are quite commendable. As you rightly said in your last paragraph, “There will be peace the day after there will be truth.” Unfortunately, truth has been ignored by politicians since the “peace process” started in 1993, which explains the existential anguish that Jews and Israelis are going through. I hope Israeli leaders will heed your call for disclosing the full truth so that they can embark upon a new era of lasting peace.

Of course, the pursuit of truth requires knowledge first. What are we to call “truth” if we have no clue of reality? Also, reality should be known in its entirety and this knowledge should not be truncated, as the Palestinians do, a point you aptly emphasize in your article. It is only when all the facts are brought to light that the full story can be told honestly. I have no doubt that honesty is paramount to you, as you mentioned this term – and any variations thereof – no less than 21 times in your piece.

I am prepared to grant you the mantle of honesty but only partially, very partially. Knowingly or not, you jumped on the honesty wagon before ascertaining the truth of what you wrote. And what you omitted from your exposé is so glaring that you are misinforming your readers in a grand scale. Like the Palestinians who regularly present their narrative in their distorted fashion, you too have grossly truncated the truth by limiting your view of reality to the post 1967 period. Had your vision not been so narrowly limited, you would have discovered that the international community recognized the historical connection of the Jewish people to the whole of Palestine, including Jerusalem, back in 1920; that Jewish settlement of the whole land, including Judea and Samaria, was not only allowed but highly encouraged; that these territories were not to be ceded to any foreign power; and that all those provisions received the imprimatur of international law.

Instead, you write that Israel is illegally occupying these territories; that the settlement of these lands should not have taken place; that this situation violates international law; and that those who challenge these views “refuse to read history honestly.” The most eminent legal experts in international law – Stephen Schwebel, Sir Elihu Lauterpacht, Eugene Rostow, Julius Stone and many others – would strongly disagree with each and every one of your assertions. On your side, though, you may find some allies in characters like Jimmy Carter; Arab academics of dubious credibility; the Neturei Karta sect; the leaders of Hamas, Fatah and Hezbollah, as well as a host of their Jewish sycophants who have been thoroughly brainwashed by the very kind of article you just wrote. I leave it to you to choose the most credible camp.

Allow me, Rabbi Kanefsky, to conclude with a saying from the Talmud: “If you add to the truth, you subtract from it.” What you did in your article is far worse: you started by subtracting from the truth. This can only be attributed to ignorance, sloppiness or, dare I say, malice. Whatever the case may be, your 21 instances of the word “honest” ring hollow. I don’t know what drove you to jettison the collective rights of the Jewish people and to disparage Jewry in the process. But I suggest that you and your supporters get better informed and, most importantly, get finally over your guilty Jewish hang-ups.

Best regards,

S.B. Toronto, Canada

P.S.: You claim that those who oppose your views “have never offered any alternative solution.” Nothing could be farther from the truth. Consider just a few of the alternatives:

- Dr. Martin Sherman: “The Humanitarian Solution”,

- MK Benny Elon: “The Israeli Initiative”